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Carlos Bazzarella
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 Posted: Tue Aug 05, 2003 1:58 pm Post subject: Re: J2ME packages |
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Kent Paul Dolan wrote:
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"asj" <k (AT) xx (DOT) com> wrote:
midp != j2me
the reasoning for the classes below was mainly because
midp is targeted at devices that are much more limited
than desktops or even powerful handhelds.
{snip}
Thanks for that analysis, but while those are all good reasons not to
try to shoehorn AWT into a cellphone (today), they are _not_ valid
reasons to avoid putting LCDUI on a desktop.
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Actually DoJa (DoCoMo's Java), which is basically competing with MIDP,
run on cell phones and it seems to be very much AWT/SWING based/inspired.
The reason for going with LCDUI (new API) has more to do with politics
(trying to please all MIDP parties) than technical necessaty. This is
usually what happens when you engineer by committee !!!
| Quote: | Doing that _forces_ developers to download and test _always_ in the
target hardware.
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You can certainly test your J2ME MIDP apps on a desktop but it is a
guarantee that it won't look or behave like on the PDA/cell phone.
You only get exact simulation if the desktop machine is also simulating
the embedded OS of the device (Nokia's simulators come to mind here).
With Java on handheld/cell phones you always have to test the app
on the targeted hardware and compensate accordinly. It is just a
fact of life.
Carlos.
| Quote: |
Based on my personal experience doing extensive embedded development,
that becomes a hideous nuisance: one wants to be able to test quickly
_on the development platform_ at least 100 times for each push to the
embedded context and confirming overall test there, just because of the
huge time overhead the latter entails.
xanthian.
--
Posted via Mailgate.ORG Server - http://www.Mailgate.ORG
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Carlos Bazzarella
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| Posted: Tue Aug 05, 2003 7:29 pm Post subject: Re: J2ME packages |
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asj wrote:
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Carlos Bazzarella wrote:
With Java on handheld/cell phones you always have to test the app
on the targeted hardware and compensate accordinly. It is just a
fact of life.
with ANY software, you had better test it on the target hardware. that's
just fact of life.
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Sure but I don't have to buy every single Windows desktop/laptop computer
out there and test my app on it to make sure it runs properly on all of
those and then make changes accordingly. Now using J2ME I have to !!!
Can you see the implementation flaw here ? The same J2ME app needs to
accomodate every piece of hardware (as I said due to implementation bugs
and inconsistencies which I thought J2ME Sun's certification would take
care of but doesn't). In case of Microsoft the operating system takes
care of all of that but in the case of J2ME it is a mess and developers
have no choice but pick a few devices and support them only.
Carlos.
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asj
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Aug 05, 2003 9:49 pm Post subject: Re: J2ME packages |
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Carlos Bazzarella wrote:
| Quote: | Sure but I don't have to buy every single Windows desktop/laptop computer
out there and test my app on it to make sure it runs properly on all of
those and then make changes accordingly. Now using J2ME I have to !!!
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windows is a single os from a single vendor. are you saying that you
will have to test you app on EVERY SINGLE MOTOROLA PHONE out there in
order to make sure it works fine?
the fact is, we've been testing our midp apps on several different phone
manufacturers and phone makes (motorola, nokia), AND THEY WORK FINE.
granted, we work on apps that don't do a lot of graphics at all (god
help me if i ever become a game developer), but a lot of enteprise apps
aren't into that either.
| Quote: | Can you see the implementation flaw here ? The same J2ME app needs to
accomodate every piece of hardware (as I said due to implementation bugs
and inconsistencies which I thought J2ME Sun's certification would take
care of but doesn't). In case of Microsoft the operating system takes
care of all of that but in the case of J2ME it is a mess and developers
have no choice but pick a few devices and support them only.
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hey, like i said, i agree with you here. you can complain to me (and
other developers out here), but you're preaching to the choir. there are
problems with incompatibilities, but none so great as to prevent midp
from continuing to successfully push into more and more handhelds and
phones.
here is a recent blog that is comparing symbian c++ porgramming to j2me:
http://www.dynamicobjects.com/d2r/archives/002208.html
as you can see, j2me might still be the better choice anyway.
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